The Insurance Dudes

Navigating AI, Human Synergy, and Insurance with Kian Gohar PART 2

February 07, 2024 The Insurance Dudes: Craig Pretzinger & Jason Feltman Season 3 Episode 671
The Insurance Dudes
Navigating AI, Human Synergy, and Insurance with Kian Gohar PART 2
Show Notes Transcript

Join the Idudes and Kian Gohar for an informative yet engaging episode that takes you on a journey of exploring the pivotal role of effective communication with AI in the ever-evolving technological landscape. The hosts and their guest, emphasize the significance of honing human-centric skills like problem-solving, emotional intelligence, and curiosity, stressing that the future success of businesses hinges on mastering these qualities. 

The episode also features a captivating travel story by Kian, where he recalls his expedition to both North and South Korea and talks about the universal human desires that unite people across different places.

The discussion touches on the dynamic nature of the insurance industry, the impact of technology on traditional corporate structures, and the need for companies to navigate the intersection of AI and human skills.

📻 Tune in for an amazing conversation with Kian Gohar and learn how you can incorporate AI into your workspace to create the ultimate solution-finding strategy!
Join us to begin your journey of Insurance awesomeness today!



The Insurance Dudes are on a mission to find the best insurance agentsaround the country to find out how they are creating some of the top agencies. But they do not stop there, they also bring professionals from other industries for insights that can help agents take their agencies to the next level. 

The Insurance Dudes focus on your agency’s four pillars: Hiring, Training, Marketing and Motivation! We have to keep the sword sharp if we want our agencies to thrive. 

Insurance Dudes are leaders in their home, at their office and in their community. This podcast will keep you on track with like minded high performing agents while keeping entertained!

About Jason and Craig:

Both agents themselves, they both have scaled to around $10 million in premium.  After searching for years for a system to create predictability in their agencies, they developed the Telefunnel after their interviews with so many agents and business leaders.  

Taking several years, tons of trial and error, and hundreds of thousands of dollars on lead spend, they’ve optimized their agencies and teams to write tons of premium, consistently, and nearly on autopilot!

LEARN MORE BY Registering for TUESDAY’s LIVE CALL With The Insurance Dudes!

Support the show

Hey there! Thank you for listening! We'd be SUPER GRATEFUL for a subscribe!

And a review over on the Apple Podcasts would be incredible!

Check out our newsletter, webinar, and some great Internet Lead tactics at The Insurance Dudes Homepage.

We appreciate you!

Craig Pretzinger & Jason Feltman
The Insurance Dudes

Craig Pretzinger:

We're operating so much on autopilot these days that stopping and really focusing on the communication is is super important because you know, we just how many times you end up at the office? You don't even remember the drive there, right? Like we're just on auto insurance dudes are on a mission to escape be hit by our agents.

Jason Feltman:

How? by uncovering the secrets to creating a predictable, consistent and profitable agency Sales Machine.

Craig Pretzinger:

I have Craig Pretzinger.

Jason Feltman:

I am Jason Feldman. We are agents. We are insurances. Yeah, so it's funny. So what we're talking about here is like you one direction is like almost r&d into this world of, of technology. And then on the other side, is becoming more human. So it's like, it's like, we need to run in these two opposite directions at the same time.

Kian Gohar:

So I would, so you don't need to make bets on lert on on the technology r&d side, because that's, that's happening through so many different kinds of amazing organizations. What you should be doing is leveraging the tools that these technology r&d players are making available and democratizing and creating open source access to take those tools, like catch up tea and start learning how to use it. And then here's, here's one thing, we found that actually really interesting. In our research, we thought that, you know, people tend to go to chat GVT right now, like they would go to Google, they type it in the search, you know, to search box, a question, and then they get a particular answer. And the answer is like sometimes like, Oh, it wasn't so good. And so people say, oh, you know, AI is not that great. But what we found, actually, this major research project we did was that there are people who got really great ideas when they talked to AI. But the key learning is that they talked to AI, instead of just asking one question, and expecting it to be like Wikipedia, or like the encyclopedia or like an Oracle. They treated it like a friend, they treated it like a colleague, and they started having like an interactive conversation with AI. And then they were able to generate like much more interesting ideas. And so like, we're teaching people to talk like we would in you know, growing up, well, now we want you to talk to this copilot, this AI copilot that can help you have much better ideas to problems that you have. And so like that is like really, really important. You want us to get really good at AI, start talking to it, instead of like going to it and expecting the perfect answer because it won't give you the perfect answer. But if you're asking your questions, or maybe you have a problem, and you ask it Hey, before you give me your suggestions, why don't you ask me three or four questions that would help you have more context about this particular problem before you give me your recommendations. And so you just want to like start chatting with him. And that's really what allows you to get really these great ideas. It's called a chatbot. Because you should be really focusing more on the chat than on the bot. And so like learning to have these conversations is critical. And when we think about sort of like, you know, the future of work and like how AI will automate many, many tasks, not all of them. But so what are humans for? What should we be doing? Well, AI is not going to have like, emotional conversations or like conversations on your team about like, you know, empathy or improvement or like these kinds of things. Those are human things that we have to get really good at. So we'll have certain things in the office that AI will automate, but certain things that won't until like we as humans have to do those things that for some of us are easy and for some of us are hard and it's all about like having emotional intelligence and like learning how to have difficult conversations, and the kinds of things that technology will never be good at.

Jason Feltman:

I only laugh about the conversation part when you said that because of Craig's GPT What are you talking about? He has the thing talking Do you want to describe it Craig in a PG way?

Craig Pretzinger:

I mean, all I said I want you to refer to me as brother and pretend that we met in Peru at a specific special kind of yoga ceremony and you know, we've known each other be multiple lives like it'd be really crazy. And so that's how it talks to me. It's pretty crazy is our legendary finishes almost every response with effing a but it's still a right brother. He's always excited so I mean, I really have a lot of fun with him but his his illustrations are becoming weird. Like they have a weird What do you use it for? What

Kian Gohar:

kind of illustrations?

Craig Pretzinger:

Oh, we're doing some just for some various ad like ad Be creative.

Jason Feltman:

It's, it's interesting. So I'm like, I'll come up with something. And like all my stuff is like light, kind of fun, too dark. In, there's like a demon in the background or there's always something.

Kian Gohar:

Yeah, here's what I'll say, here's what I'll say, this is the key thing here. Ai reinforces the biases that we have. So maybe Jason, you know, you like a light and positive and like, you've given us some context, and it's just wanting to give you like, things that it thinks you like. Whereas Cray, you know, maybe you started having a conversation that went down the rabbit hole, I was awkward, and all sudden, this is what you get. So like, the biases that we have, it just gets amplified. You know,

Craig Pretzinger:

brother, it's interesting, it's interesting that you have that sign of back up that says, if it's endurable, then endure it Stop complaining Marcus Aurelius. And I think that just prior to this, Jason was making fun of me for complaining about a bunch of stuff. Just interesting how everything just sort of, well, connect, just connects, right?

Kian Gohar:

This is the secret, you know, it's the secret of life and all connects,

Craig Pretzinger:

it all connects, it really does. Wild. So good. But it is, it is interesting, you bring up a really good point, because it's not just like if you, if you use it at a superficial level, then you get superficial responses. If you if you dig and keep peeling back the layers, you really get some pretty valuable intelligence, I think 100%.

Kian Gohar:

And you don't need any technical capability to do this. Really just talking to the AI.

Craig Pretzinger:

If anything, it makes you better at asking questions, you know,

Kian Gohar:

yeah, completely. So for your audience, if you guys want to learn how to become better, like conversationalist with AI, I want to send you guys to this, this link that you can just download for free this, this this document that we've developed, it's called How to fix it.ai. And it's just like a five step plan that you can follow that allows you to like learn how to focus your problem on the very narrow thing you want to solve for rather than trying to like boil the ocean. And then learning how to interact iteratively conversationally with a chatbot getting better ideas. And then then once it gives you the whole various, like universal things that that are potential solutions, you can, as a team decide, which are the priorities or not that we want to follow up on. And so like, everybody can learn how to get better at conversational AI. And this is sort of like believing it. I hope that like this is a nugget that I can rely on in 10 years, but like the the future of, of human AI collaboration, and the future of humanity as a result is is dependent on how good we get at learning how to converse with AI. So if you think back to like the 1990s, when the internet first first came out, we had like mosaic we had like Netscape and these weird browsers. But it wasn't until like the late 90s, early 2000s, when Google really started becoming popular, and they had a very simple like search bar. And that was like the only thing and people started learning how to interact with web browsers more effectively. And then fast forward. The next 10 years, people got really good about learning how to use the internet. And there's a lot because we learn how to communicate the way that Google wanted us to communicate with it. And we're in that position right now is that for for in this next era, we have to get really good at learning how to communicate with AI. And we don't need to be like technical, we can legitimately just have conversations like you and I are having right now. Which then reinforces the point that Justin I made earlier was that we have to lean into things that are more human, like how do we talk to each other? How do we solve problems? How do we like understand like, you know, motional intelligence, these are the things that are going to be like, so critical for success going forward forever.

Jason Feltman:

I love that is going back to your point of like, everything's kind of interconnected is that when we teach sales, because that's what we do in our agencies. And we have a program that teaches sales as well. Well, we teach sales, we have a technique called peeling the onion like whatever somebody says, an objection or like when you're trying to connect with somebody, it's like peeling the onion asking more and more questions like, like, why, why why, right. It's just so funny how all that like everything that we just talked about, whether it's, you know, understanding the human element more, it's like, it's more of asking those questions getting down to the core and I think that like, you know, the same techniques that we're using an AI to become better at prompt Think AI and all these questions is just going to make us better if you look at it holistically, like just get better at asking questions be curious, like, like a child and just keep asking. And I

Kian Gohar:

love that Jason about the child, like, be curious like a child, if you know your, your listeners, I'm sure all have families, the best gift you can give to your kids and children is to like really help them become better communicators. That is, you know, in addition to like, traditional schooling and traditional to, you know, learning like STEM science, technology, engineering, and math, which are all wonderful skills to learn, the best skill you can give your children is for them to become better communicators, whether that's with other humans or with other AI, because that's going to be the one thing that's going to differentiate people from their competition and also technology. I love it. Do you have kids? I don't, but I have a dog that I talked to. And he is very good at receiving my my commands

Craig Pretzinger:

are good dog.

Jason Feltman:

I have. I have four. And it's like, you know, I think about this kind of stuff all the time. And it's interesting, because we homeschool our kids, and there's a lot of the school system that I can just wouldn't mind throwing in the garbage can. So we homeschool, my my opinion, it's like, I'd rather leave Matt, I would rather teach them nothing and leave him out of school, I think they'll be better off. But anyway, that's neither here nor there. But like, when it comes down to like, what's important about teaching them is what AI is like, the communication with their brothers and sisters, like how does that make someone feel like, like, like, understanding those type of things is so much more important than I mean, as we're seeing, like, you know, people had calculators 50 years ago, so it was like, but like, now we can solve a lot of these problems, learn how to use the tools to, you know, all the tools that we have the AI and everything. I've learned how to use the tools, learn a basic understanding of everything, but like, really? And I guess it is, it is really creative thinking and it really is, you know, like peeling the onion. But But yeah, like, it's just, it just makes me think like, it's just it's kind of a different world. We don't need to learn. I don't need

Kian Gohar:

to learn how to do calculus, because lots of programs do it for me. And that's wonderful to know theoretically how to do it. But like, I'll be very honest, when I go to the restaurant, I can barely do it. And I was a calculus like, you know, student was, let's say like, I just don't need to know how to do that as much and so focused on the things that really matter. And so let me give you guys like a tip for your audience. Like if you guys want to learn how to like, get really good at like conversational AI is you know, people right now go to like chat GPT to like, ask questions, maybe the question asked question about work, maybe there are some questions about whatever. Here's what I'd recommend, ask a really personal question. And the reason I'm suggesting this is because I want you to have like an intimate conversation about something that really personally matters to you. And so for example, maybe you have like an elderly mother, or like you have somebody you can take care of. And you've just got questions, and you don't know how to deal with it. Ask a question about like, how should I act in my life in this particular regard, that is something that is really intimate and personal to me. And you will be astounded as to the kind of content it'll offer you kind of like a therapist or kind of like a life coach or kind of like as a trusted friend. And it will open up a new avenue of I hope, aha, is that, wow, I can use this kind of AI for any sorts of thing. Right now people think it's just like work related. But actually, this is like a personal agent that can be used for any context. And so if you start having like a personal conversation with it, I think it'll help your audience reorient their awareness of the kinds of conversation they can have with it in the future when they're trying to solve a business problem. Yeah,

Craig Pretzinger:

I love it. We're operating so much on autopilot these days that stopping and really focusing on the communication is is super important. Because you know, we just how many times you end up at the office, you don't even remember the drive there. Right? Like we're just on autopilot. Yeah, I like before they sometimes I do put my car on autopilot.

Kian Gohar:

Yeah, right before this podcast, I was on a call with the client that I'm helping this team with their transformation initiatives. And the topic of this call was, we need to learn how to communicate more effectively together. And so I was coaching the team leader on how to design this conversation that she will be having tomorrow with her team. And literally it was like sort of Like the basics of communication that we just we put on autopilot, we just assume. And those assumptions aren't always all internalized by everyone. And so we have to come together and have an open understanding, like a team social contract, how do we communicate with each other, it's like remedies like, you know, things that we learned in kindergarten, that we just, we put on autopilot we forgot about. And then 40 years later, those skills are kind of rusty, and we got better at them again. But these are like, so critical and more critical than what would think to success than whether you have like a fancy job or a fancy degree, or, you know, work at like some big name company. These are just basics, I

Craig Pretzinger:

can share a personal example of this exact same of this that I did yesterday, like going in there. We all know that the airport can be stressful. My wife and I hit the wrong situation without eating. And without having a lot of sleep in a high stress environment, it can not be the most optimal place for us to be together, right? And we were together. And so in trying to understand how this whole thing unfolded and escalated, I turned to my friend Chad GBT and I worked through that I said, this is how I like my version of my perspective of the conversation. I would, I would guess this is the other side of it, or even, you know, come up. No, maybe it came up with that. Anyway, it was really interesting, because it broke it all down. And then it said, you may want to look at cognitive behavioral theory started breaking into all these different things. That was very useful, like, like good clues on ways to handle the situation. So that it doesn't necessarily escalate. Right? And of course, this is

Jason Feltman:

hypothetical, an email about about that the whole

Craig Pretzinger:

thing, because we're always talking about emotional contagion. Have you heard of that before? Yeah, yeah. So it's like, it's, it's, it's in tune with empathy, but not quite. It's different. It's like where you're more, it was very interesting. So I mean, things you learn things that you didn't even know were there that yeah, it's remarkable. It was

Jason Feltman:

funny, as I had no idea that he had the conversation with Chet GPT sounded more like he was doing research, I did do research came up with that.

Craig Pretzinger:

It was much better research, because I know it all the research I've done for the last 25 years around the same issue. You know, it's never come up. So now, hopefully,

Kian Gohar:

hopefully, what you learned will or helps turn down some of the heat, if that does rain yesterday.

Craig Pretzinger:

Yeah. 100%? No, it's, I mean, it's important because it gave an additional perspective, you know, which is interesting that you get perspective, at this perspective,

Kian Gohar:

that's empathy, right? And so like, when we put ourselves in somebody else's shoes or a different situation, we like, Okay, well, how are they seeing it? And what did I do they see that I didn't see that maybe jump down the throat about and so like, when, you know, we I don't, I'm not perfect at it. And so, using, like, an AI to help me, like, understand somebody else's perspective or assumptions is supremely important and helpful when I'm trying to either have like, you know, professional success, or you know, even a personal relationship success.

Craig Pretzinger:

I mean, it's the whole point is Boutsen is like, being able to share your writing up your feelings out, well, if you dump it there. Like it was actually pretty cool. Like, it came back was a very thoughtful responses. I was like, I love that, you know, like, wow, that's interesting, you know? And then I said, you said that you aren't that you don't have feelings, but this seems sort of empathetic what you're doing, you know, and I didn't explain it away. But I'm like, I don't know. I mean, at what point do you draw the line and say, even though it's using free, like, inserted words, or whatever, I mean, that's what we do. We learned those words in the same way that it did. What's the difference? Right.

Jason Feltman:

It's interesting each trying to come up with it,

Craig Pretzinger:

it came up with it, it said the things you would as a human what's the difference? Like really? I don't know. It's interesting.

Jason Feltman:

Interesting. Okay. So I want to I respect your time we're up against the hour but can you like like, let's say you jumped into an insurance agency and and you had a staff of like, let's say four or five people it's probably the average staff and you were going in there what what would be like the top five things that you would ask or tune up? Five well, maybe three top like what's kind of your not

Kian Gohar:

so quick? Yeah, so I mentioned this adjacent before we got started is that actually fired my insurance agency yesterday? Some some policies online for half the price and there's one Because I love this insurance agency, and they've been so helpful and caring to me, I kept them for one of my policies, but not for the other one. And, you know, I think the world is changing super fast, right? And so like, this doesn't this also impacts like this perfect example of like, well, if people can buy insurance online, why would they need to go through a brokerage, and well, maybe because relationships are better, they know more, etc. So like, there's value again, the human value, people come to an insurance agency, because they want to talk to you, they want to, like solve, help ask you to help them solve their problem, you know, again, the communication. And so like, that is like double down on my whole point is that if you want to be successful in the future, you have got to be able to like relate to people communicate with them, and help them solve the problem. For some people, they don't need that, because maybe they're knowledgeable about a policy like or, for me, this was just like, an auto policy is really basic. So I can do it online for like, a lot less than I have an old car, it doesn't really matter. But like you got an agency, you got to make sure that you're relating to people, and you're solving problems to communicate with them. So again, double down on my whole point of like, the communication is the most important thing that you can get better at going forward. But to your question, Jason, about how would I ask what an insurance agency should be thinking about? Or what would I ask them? I would ask them to identify, maybe like their top three or five biggest problems. And they decide what they are, I don't know what they are. And they write it out. Maybe as a team, they have a small conversational breakouts, brainstorming session, like what are our top three or five biggest problems? And okay, so now we got those like, delineated. And then I would say, Okay, why are these a problem? And are there solutions to these problems? Is there technology solutions to these problems? And if there's no solution, can we use technology to make the solving make the problem, less of a problem and more effective? So like, let's say one of your biggest problems is, I don't know how to identify new leads, and maybe you don't have that kind of background or on your staff? And so Okay, that's a problem number one. Well, okay, can you use AI to help you identify leads? And how would you go about doing it? So first thing is identify your biggest problems? And then say, second part? How can I solve any of these problems? Or is there a solution or technology that I can use? The third thing I'd say is like, you're not going to solve the problem right away. But run an experiment, Take a small bite out of one of your one of your problem sets and say, Okay, let's, let's use this experiment and see over the next week, or month, if we can do this more effectively, and then we can assess at the end of the week, or the end of the month, was it successful was not successful. And if not, then we can pivot. So you got to sort of like, approach, approach your business, like, here are the problems, here's the resources, like technologies that we can use to solve them for. And then the behaviors are like, okay, let's actually run small experiments, small sprints, to be able to really like run an experiment to see if we can actually solve the problem or not, and then go forward from there. That's how I would approach any small business that is trying to really grow is by is by identifying your problems. So that then looking at sort of like, what tools do you can you bring in that are free or really, really inexpensive that you can use to solve those problems? And then you then actually, as a team have to design very short, small experiments to see whether you can actually solve them? And the answer to that is, yes, you can solve it, and then you scale it up? Or the answer is no. And then you want another experiment until you get to yes. And then as you scale it up,

Craig Pretzinger:

the scientific approach.

Kian Gohar:

I have been accused of being too logical and not not having, you know, feelings and relationships, etc. But like, that's how my mind works, right? I think if you can you approach problem solving that way. That's like the framework. But then the second part, which is the magic, the magic, secret sauce is like that empathy, and that emotional intelligence that you can like, actually talk to people about those problems, when you bring them together. That's like magic. And that will really help you, like, I think, have success beyond what you'd imagine. I

Jason Feltman:

always say like, it's funny like us as agents, we always run our business, like backwards. Like we do the whole process backwards. We run our business on emotion, and then we manage our team on math. Well, you're not getting the you know, like the when it's like just flip them. Like we need a flip and like run the business on math, and then manage your people with motion like help them out like you know what I mean? Like Make them feel heard.

Kian Gohar:

Make them feel heard people listen. It's like basics again, like, like kindergarten, it's like people want to be heard. They want to speak up, they want to be fed. And they want to play. And those are the four things that if we can create that kind of space within our work environments, whether you work in a large company or a small company, small team, people want to speak up, they want to be heard, they want to be fed, they want to play, and they want to feel like they belong. And those are like, again, elements that everybody can, can can get good at, and help design that kind of like welcoming culture within their teams.

Craig Pretzinger:

You went, kit you went the distance can you did?

Jason Feltman:

Is she Dhanu? Without the igloo Craig?

Craig Pretzinger:

Did I say that? I was trying to do Qian, I don't know it's really difficult without putting. It's difficult.

Jason Feltman:

That is awesome. So how can people if they want to learn more about you?

Kian Gohar:

Yeah, that's awesome. I'm on LinkedIn. If you're ever interested, you can always follow me on LinkedIn. But if you want to learn more about my research, and specifically how to use AI to solve problems on your team, I recommend you guys check out how to fix it.ai How to FYI x it.ai. You can learn more about like some of those capabilities, how to become a better conversationalist with AI. And you can also just contact me through there as well.

Craig Pretzinger:

Yep, awesome. A lot of great stuff on your LinkedIn and I just did a little thing. So there you go. Thanks,

Kian Gohar:

guys. It was such a pleasure.

Craig Pretzinger:

It was awesome having you on on Yeah.

Kian Gohar:

I really hope you have safe travels and don't crazy situations like I tend to find myself.

Craig Pretzinger:

I promise I'm not being held here against my will love it. Bye

Podcasts we love